Limit, Pick & Shoehorn RR -- Dallas M's layout project

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mad gerald
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Postby mad gerald » Sun Jan 18, 2009 6:51 pm

Sorry guys,

my engineers are proposed to drive the loco standing upright - I should have said ...

The big window (right) is going to be separated in 3 smaller (rectangular)windows by putting in 2 styrene stripes vertically.

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Postby dana » Mon Jan 19, 2009 1:47 am

actualy i like the logging crane details for the bonnet and re: the windows i have or did have an old article on brookville locos , they built a loco with a tall cab and two windows infront (i guess one for sitting down and one for standing up ) so yor ideas not far off :roll: .
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RED DWARF SPACE PORT RR( GN 15)

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Postby Dallas_M » Mon Jan 19, 2009 2:10 am

A little further progress ...

Image

Short version: Mock-up of heftier frame with new truck side frame underway ... will make some refinements and/or further detail (like bolster end detail) ... then, hopefully cast a full set of these.

Long-winded version: With some effort to organize the thoughts. :roll:
a) I really like the look of the skirted chassis and think something like that would work really well with a suitable 6-wheel chassis.
b) Was all set to "disregard" Prof K's compelling arguments for retaining the twin-bogie appearance in favor of the bulkier skirted appearance.
c) Cut out skirt and removed truck-cover panels to be installed separately for extra detail ...
d) Experienced the "Random X" factor that John New described here:
http://forum.gn15.info/viewtopic.php?t=4869
e) Held the skirt with openings over the chassis and finally "glimpsed" :idea: a way to make the frame bulkier and build up the truck frames without too much effort. (And, when attempting to re-rail the loco with mock-up skirts in place, found that exceptionally difficult!)
f) Tried a variety of frame bits and kitbashed the truck frame shown above ... needs some bolster detail and maybe other refinements ... but likely I can get something going from here. (The Bachmann On30 passenger truck was a "near" candidate too -- w/b is almost the same)
g) See, that really was painful and long winded! :!: :lol:

Other notes:
-- Thanks again to everyone for the various feedback ... no doubt more will be asked along the way!
-- Gerry & Gerald: thanks for the notes/thoughts on cab heights for various projects ... sure myself and others will revisit this subject often while planning other projects.
-- Martin: expect to have all the various doors, panels and/or hatches set slightly ajar, askew, unhinged, etc to add some depth ... without having anything that would show the "electrical gizzards" of the actual HO chassis!
-- Prof K: Thanks for the compelling "arguments" in favor of the twin-bogie design! :wink:
Cheers,
Dallas

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Postby Prof Klyzlr » Mon Jan 19, 2009 2:37 am

Dear Dallas,

Should have thought about it, the big square plate frames evident on NG and "ballasted" 44 tonners, (to bring them up to 50 tons or more),
give a very similar visual look...

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/191/490633547_3d3ead86ba.jpg?v=0

And another option, C/O LaJeune Steel

Image

Hope this Helps...
Happy Modelling,
Aim to Improve,
Prof Klyzlr

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Postby Mike » Tue Jan 20, 2009 9:45 pm

:) :) Great Modeling, luv th critter fab, thus fer. Th Blomberg trucks give it a heaftier look :roll: , but dosent detract from the small critter look. The Lajeune loco is most striking. Looks mo lik a Al La Da Burple Candy Co Loco 8) , than a mining Loco :?:
Most times most thingies can be bent to a narrow way,or so it seems to this narrow minded railer. Mike

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Postby Dallas_M » Thu Jan 22, 2009 10:00 am

Making little bits of progress ... :D :D :D

Image

-- Added a styrene wrapper to the top of the "Barnhart bonnet" ... and cardstock mock-up of hood side panels ...
-- Started "messing around" with details ... probably will hang a muffler on the front of cab, but piping will be arranged appropriately! :lol:
-- Finished the first truck side frame (not shown) and set that up for the next round of mold-making so I can have a full set ...
-- And ...

Image

-- Fabricated the "Quasimodo" hunchback rear end ... only need to add billions and billions of rivets, rig up an actual air tank and all that stuff ...
-- Still miles to go before I sleep ... well, no, think that's enough for this very late night! 8)
Cheers,

Dallas



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Postby SOUTHPASS » Thu Jan 22, 2009 10:17 am

Love it Dallas, getting that 1920's look about it. I can see a Packard or Duesenberg parked along side of it in a dark alley :lol:
.....WARNING....
Contains images that anoraks may find disturbing.
1:24 scale 16.5mm gauge.
Yes I know it's all old and rusty, but I just model things as I see them......
Have a good one....John B.

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Postby mad gerald » Thu Jan 22, 2009 11:59 am

Hi Dallas,

good work!

Only the headlight seems a little bulky to me ... and may I suggest to put the exhaust pipe/muffler on the roof (pointing backwards)?

BTW: How did you make the "ventilation slits" of the hunchback rear - simply cutting in the styrene - or is there more to it?

I did not make any progess at the moment while still thinking about the construction of my cab - your "little bose box cab" gave me some additional inspiration ...

:P And what about your carlo spirito guy? Did he manage to get out/in the cab - and what's he doing now? :P

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Postby scott b » Thu Jan 22, 2009 12:21 pm

You got a ton of work done! I think the chunky look of everything really works. Million $ question, whats the roof to look like? I think Mad G. has a point, you should try the muffler on the roof. There`s a guy in your area who casts some :wink: that would be quicker. Although height may be an issue depending where you are running it (voice of experience here)
Scott B

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Postby Dallas_M » Thu Jan 22, 2009 11:30 pm

Thanks for the notes! Hope to pour mold for the truck side frame tonight ...

John -- Glad it's getting the 20's look to it, sounds right! No Duesenbergs on the line, but I've got a 1/24 Model T ... and the loco is similar in length, but much bulkier. Hood could likely house one of those big straight-8 or maybe even 12-cylinder engines for some "real" power.

Gerald -- Yes, louvers were cut and formed in place on styrene sheet. I'll shoot some photos when I get a chance to show the technique for "bending" them to get the right look. Might drive you cuckoo, but I'll probably use some chunky headlight and bell castings for fun! :lol:

Image

Scott -- This photo will show where much of the inspiration came from ... I like the contrast of the relatively flat roof with the bulky, rounded hood and the hunchback rear. Of course, my loco is much "GNARROWER" ... so I'm not going for the low, squat look of the cab in photo ... but likely that I'll mimic the roof line.

Exhaust -- At this point (subject to change!), I expect to mount the muffler to front of cab ... use an elbow to direct lower pipe end into side of hood ... point upper pipe straight up.

Still waiting for a package of rivets to arrive from Grandt Line ... :roll: 8)
Cheers,

Dallas



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Postby Prof Klyzlr » Fri Jan 23, 2009 1:16 am

Dear Dallas,

RE prototype image:

Very "Yella Terra"...
("Yellow Terror" for those who are not speaking in Aussie Accent... :wink: )

RE Powerplants

Maybe the Life Like flatcar load "Power Generator" (CAT 8 cylinder),

or for brawny power, the Walthers HO EMD 657 engine block?

...And don't worry about the fact that the front truck tower will get in the way,

I've "sectioned" such engines down the centre, and "widened"/Hollowed-out the block so it allows the truck tower to swing L<>R before with success.

If you view the block from the side,
(IE with the hood louvres "open"),
it looks fine,

and with a suitably larger fan mounted in front,
no-one will be able to tell that the engine block is "overwidth" when viewed thru the front grille...
(Oops, didn't mean to inspire you to tear apart that Barnhart-based hood assaembly.... :wink: )
Happy Modelling,

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Postby scott b » Fri Jan 23, 2009 2:45 am

So now I remember I have 2 of those locos under a pile of dust from the week I thought On30 was the cats a.., you always have such interesting builds, and my list is huge (and so is that loco) I`ll just add it to the bottom.
The roof line looks good and it keeps it sorta low so any tunnels or buildings won`t have really high openings.
Yellow or green?
Scott B

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Postby mad gerald » Fri Jan 23, 2009 7:51 am

Dallas_M wrote:Might drive you cuckoo, but I'll probably use some chunky headlight and bell castings for fun! :lol:


Hi Dallas,

... it's OK with me, 'cause I'm stark raving mad ... :lol:

Dallas_M wrote:Exhaust -- At this point (subject to change!), I expect to mount the muffler to front of cab ... use an elbow to direct lower pipe end into side of hood ... point upper pipe straight up.


... or put in another elbow on the muffler and direct the exhaust pipe backwards ... :lol: :lol:

The "yellow fellow" on your pic seems like a BILLARD Locotracteur from France to me ... I too discovered some similar pics in the WWW recently

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Postby Dallas_M » Fri Jan 23, 2009 10:28 am

mad gerald wrote:The "yellow fellow" on your pic seems like a BILLARD Locotracteur from France to me ... I too discovered some similar pics in the WWW recently


Oooh, thank you! Had that photo for a long time and no idea where I'd collected it ... quick search shows a number of BILLARD Locotracteurs ... and that's it! Guess I have to change the setting of my layout to France now :lol: ... or at least find some good croissant chocolat to enjoy during the next work session. :wink:

Perhaps I was attacted to the design because I'm part French ... ?

Also, most of the photos show an exhaust pipe running along the side of the loco beneath the cab ... interesting possibility, but since mine is a freelance Billard tres Grande, I may still put the muffler on the cab front ...

Thanks for the ideas Prof ... I have some flat motor panels from my old On30 boxcab kit that might work for an open motor panel ... we'll see! :shock:

Scott, too many projects and ideas? Geez, I never met a modeler who had THAT problem! :lol:
Cheers,

Dallas



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Postby macbain » Fri Jan 23, 2009 12:59 pm

Dallas:

That lok is so gneat! Any thoughts on colour?

Can't wait to learn how to do the louvres.

Ben
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Postby Dallas_M » Fri Jan 23, 2009 1:54 pm

macbain wrote:Dallas:

That lok is so gneat! Any thoughts on colour?

Can't wait to learn how to do the louvres.

Ben


Hi Ben --

Thanks! Scott asked about color too, and I forgot to answer ... well, the "answer" is I'm not sure yet! :lol:

On the one hand, I think a faded/weathered oxide red would be good for creating a "vintage" look ... and make it easier to photograph with rolling stock that's likely to be oxide red, weathered wood, etc.

On the other hand, camoflouge tan would show off the details nicely ... and that color can weather quite nicely too ... (okay, we don't have a suitable tan font color here!) :?

Those are the two prime candidates at the moment ... we'll see! I don't think I'd go to yellow, green or orange ... but I do like gray with oxide trim as a possible third choice ... decisions, decisions! :roll:

Meanwhile, I've been giving some thought on how to diagram and photograph the louver-making. The technique itself is quite simple, but shooting the pix in a clear, obvious way is an interesting challenge ... might be a few days or a week before I can set aside time to do that.
Cheers,

Dallas



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Postby Rob R » Fri Jan 23, 2009 8:41 pm

Dallas

Recently found this site dealing with Eastern US coal mine exploration (and a sister site dealing with ironstone).


http://www.undergroundminers.com/index.html


Well worth a browse when you have an hour or two to spare.

Mega critter looking good

Rob
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Postby Willow Creek Traction » Fri Jan 23, 2009 9:11 pm

Traction Orange weathered to almost that tan :?: With an oxide red paint patch or panel somewhere as a "beauty mark" :?:
later, Forrest Today's scientists have substituted mathematics for experiments, and they wander off through equation after equation, and eventually build a structure which has no relation to reality. -- Nikola Tesla, July, 1934

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Postby Dallas_M » Wed Jan 28, 2009 9:43 pm

Well, we had snow and ice here today ... so I took a "snow day" and did some more work on the critter ...

Image

Built a radiator ... which is now officially powered by a Hoyt-Clagwell tractor engine. Now, let's see who knows that reference ... :lol:

Image

Made substantial progress detailing the hood ... decided to keep it closer to "simple" (too late!) by opting out of the ideas for open panels ... except for one little cut-away toward the rear for the gonkulator cooling unit ... 8)

Image

Posted a "how-to" on the louvers in another thread:
http://forum.gn15.info/viewtopic.php?t=4902

Now the snow and ice has turned to rain :? ... so I guess I've gotta get back to work ... 8)
Cheers,

Dallas



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Postby scott b » Wed Jan 28, 2009 10:15 pm

You need to have your wagons full of waxed fruit. I think thats what Mr.Hoyt went into after the tractor business folded.
Now Mr. Douglas I have a fine tractor to sell you, it was previously owned by Mr. Ziffel well it was actually Arnold but he did let Fred use it .

It is coming along nicely, great work on the rad.
Scott B

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Postby michael » Thu Jan 29, 2009 1:46 am

Dallas How did you make the radiator?
Regards Michael
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Postby Dallas_M » Thu Jan 29, 2009 1:34 pm

Hi Michael --

Radiator construction:
-- I marked a piece of .060" styrene sheet slightly wider and slightly taller than the hood (which had already been constructed).
-- Traced the arch of the matching hood onto the "blank" ... then cut and filed the styrene to match the curve ... and beveled the outside edges. Also cut a matching "blank" for the back of the radiator.
-- Cut an interior opening in the front ... traced a protractor to make the arch ... also beveled the interior edges. "Beveling" done with a foam sanding stick.
:arrow: This is probably the bit you're after :!: : Cut a piece of Plastruct #91702 N Scale Tread Plate to fit behind the opening in the radiator front. This sheet has the diamond pattern in it ... and it's likely that Slater's or someone else has something similar. This sheet is THICK ... about .060"
-- Added that diamond material behind the opening, some shims along the edges and "sandwiched" all the parts to the desired thickness ... around .180" thick for this model. Added a few bits of styrene strip over the diamond material for interest ...
-- Cut a strip of .005" styrene sheet to wrap the edges ... but not cover the bevel on the front ... similar "wrapper" visible on the Billard prototype photo previously posted.

Scott --

You're on the right track ... or tractor! :lol: For those seeking "prototype" info on a smaller Hoyt-Clagwell in farming use:
http://www.maggiore.net/greenacres/wallpaper.asp

[Warning: Link leads to "silly" stuff ... but it's clean! :lol: ]
Cheers,

Dallas



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Postby michael » Thu Jan 29, 2009 7:32 pm

Thanks Dallas, I thought it might have been a sandwhich but wasnt sure.
Regards Michael

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Postby teetrix » Thu Jan 29, 2009 8:20 pm

How about a dark grey with a little bit of rust and red/white warning stripes (or yellow/black as you like this more) on the front and back of the frame? Red/white pattern was used in Germany until 1960's and seems a little bit nostalgic to me.

btw: the radiator grill is awesome. I think, the lettering is slaters?

Michael

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Postby KeithB » Thu Jan 29, 2009 8:34 pm



Ah - the Thurso and Nation Valley Railway's 50-tonner! My favorite standard-gauge line. Was still operating as a logging line just north of Ottawa, Ontario, into the 1980's using 70-tonners and the 50-tonner. The 50-tonner is now a preserved item and, yes, I have been in the cab....:lol:

(Sorry, wandered a bit off-topic there....)
Last edited by KeithB on Thu Jan 29, 2009 8:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Regards,
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