Macton works developments

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Macton works developments

Postby michael » Wed Apr 19, 2006 6:18 pm

I think that one of the reasons that Macton Loco Works has been hung up for a while is that there was something about the logic of the place that was not well thought out(it was my first attempt at building one of these)

I am thinking of adding another 9 inches to the frontside of this layout so that the yard can be more useable. I am also thinking of adding a standard gauge spur into the yard from the left side coming to a buffer by the big building on the right side. and there will be a bit of a parking lot next to the building beyond the spur.

The left side of the layout will get a wrought iron fence with a gate post into the yard, I dont want to block the view looking into the yard from the left. I am also thinking of adding some sort of yard crane, it could be a gantry or a swivel type. loading a standard gauge flat wagon with a new loco., for trans-shipment to one of the various tourist lines around the country.

here is a rough mock up of the changes being considered.

Image

Any comments or do you all think I'm nuts :?:
Last edited by michael on Sat Dec 08, 2007 2:03 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby michael » Thu Apr 20, 2006 4:21 am

Following up on suggestion I managed to find a drawing of a GWR Hydra lowboy wagon it is the 6-8ton capacity type. I laminated the paper to some card and some foamcore, the wheels are a bit wonky(offset) but it gives me the general idea.

The hydra is a bit big but its low profile fits better I think than a regular flat car and when it is built and painted brown I think it will appear even smaller.

Image

Bertrand is just adjusting the chains on the rusty hulk :wink:

Image

Now to find the right gantry crane, any sugestions :?:
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Postby AndyA » Thu Apr 20, 2006 6:22 am

That looks really great. The contrast between the 15" and standard gauge is brought out really well, but you've got enough extra space in that nine inches that the wagon doesn't really dominate the scene.

I'm just thinking about the point I made about portable railways for timber extraction: just about the whole kit and kaboodle would fit on two of those wagons, portable track included.

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Postby michael » Mon Apr 24, 2006 5:45 am

Looking at the new or should I say expanded layout, I ended up playing with the buildings a bit in hopes that I could improve on the overall layout.

This is the result of the shifting around of walls :!: it looks like I am going to have to make a few more walls of bricks Oh well :shock: more finger gnumbing watercolour paper cutting, (I might finish this this decade)I'm sorry but the printed stuff just doesn't cut it for me, I like the exagerated depth that happens with the "Bidwell method" It seems that the true depth of the brick lines that happen with embossing are just not quite as real as the over exagerated cut grooves caused by removing the small pieces of material between the bricks with the method that I started with.

The room around the area that Mercury is parked just seemed a bit too tight, I wanted to give a little more space around the crane loading area.

Image

The walls will be all the same height at the back, I didnt cut any new bits but was just playing with the stuff I had to hand. I will need to sort out a man door on the upper level but it seemed that I needed to have a man door on the lower level by the parking lot come loading area. The rails under the overhead crane will be embedded so that the lorries can be loaded or unloaded as well as the standard gauge wagons.

the balance of the standard gauge wil be exposed sleepers with the normal ballast.
I still have to resolve the left side of the layout which will have a foot added, this will be the entrance to the yard from the road.
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Postby michael » Fri Apr 28, 2006 2:14 am

It took me a while to get back into it, I just couldn't figure out what was not working, but I am excited about the new direction.

I am also looking forward to building the standard gauge wagon, and the overhead crane.

Here is a cross section through the crane area
Image
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Postby michael » Fri Apr 28, 2006 3:43 pm

In the previous section view, the vertical line closest to the standard gauge rails is the opposite side of the clearances that are in Greenlys
"Model Railways" published in 1924, on page 18

It is a great chart that shows the loading gauge at a platform and tunnel, for 00, 0, 1, 2 1/2" gauges

The second line was just to give some additional clearance for walking by the crane post, because it seemed a bit tight.

I hadn't anticipated doing any loading or unloading from the standard gauge wagon onto a lorry, as the tracks will be embeded under the crane to allow for the loading or unloading of a lorry

Image

This is the revised layout plan showing the paved loading area next to the dock, under the crane. As you can see I still haven't sorted out the left side area yet.
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Postby michael » Mon May 01, 2006 2:40 am

My how quickly the time flies when you are having fun :)

Here is a picture of the extended baseboard, it is 20mm ply for the structure and 3mm MDF for the flat surfaces all glued and brad nailed to the original baseboard.

Now I can get on and really finish this layout. Next a bit of sanding and filling then I will lay the standard gauge track. Fortunately I won't have to worry about the noise on the standard gauge as it will be basically a static wagon.

Image

The overall size now is 60 inches by 24 inches which is still managable. I think I might put some folding banquet table legs under it.
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Postby michael » Wed May 03, 2006 6:20 am

The neat thing about working on a layout with 2 different gauges is it allows a lot of opportunity for some interesting contrasts.

I have glued down all the standard gauge sleepers and ballasted them with the classic method of a fine mist of wet water(a bit of dishsoap added) then eyedropped a 50/50 mix of carpenters glue and water. It took about 1/2 hour to get the ballast looking right. I thought that it would be easier to spike the track down after the ballast had dried, so the rails are just resting there for the picture.

Image

the little sequence can be seen here
http://s5.photobucket.com/albums/y169/my30mm/Macton/

I am going to bring up the embedded surface with some black foamcore and then work over the surface to give it a tarmac look.
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Postby michael » Wed May 03, 2006 2:28 pm

What I have in mind the sort of unkempt siding that is only used on accasion(road is cheaper, an illusion in the long run) and the usual debris and detrius that gathers in these sorts of places, odd scraps of paper, cups , tires, bent broken bicycles, etc. it will of course have its compliment of weeds and the like, maybe a loose fishplate hanging off one of the rail joints.

I need to make some sleeper plates next before the rail gets put down, and the rail also needs rusting up a bit.

Still pondering the left side of the layout, I am thinking some sort of bigger building than the original paint shop or perhaps an outdoor storage area with the assorted piles of tube and steel plate that one would find in a place that builds machinery, maybe a few piles of castings of wheels and the like. After all the official title of the place is The Macton Locomotive Works & Foundry, that would then make sense of the little spur into that area, to pick up supplies to take into the shop. :)
I am off to a meeting in the east end of town today and there are some industrial sites with that sort of outdoor storage so I'll take along the camera.
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Postby michael » Thu May 04, 2006 5:00 am

I spiked down the open track this evening the tie plates are .020" styrene by a scale 7"x 11" I had to shorten the square spikes to about an 1/8th of an inch because I didn't want to try to push them into the MDF. Since the track is more for display than running I think it will be ok. I might have to put a few drops of ACC if it look like it is going to come loose with the slight flexing of the baseboard when it is moved.

I found some irregular 1/24th scale plastruct brick sheeting that I am going to use along the edge of the dock.

I found a couple of pairs of wheel that were going to be used for something in a larger scale that look about right for the lowboy wagon I just need to thin them up a bit.

The ballast is now well set and I can start to add some weathering to the track and ballast.

Image

There are a couple of other pics on the photobucket site.
http://s5.photobucket.com/albums/y169/my30mm/Macton/?sc=1&multi=3&addtype=local&media=image
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Postby michael » Thu May 04, 2006 11:33 am

The standard gauge track profile is Atlas three rail flex track and this rail is the middle rail it is already blackened. the size is code 210. I still need to rust it a bit when i finish the weathering.
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Postby michael » Sat May 13, 2006 2:09 am

I have now finalized the brick building and the loading dock shape.
the crane position is mocked up.
The roof is glued in and I am thinking about some skylights.

Image

there are a few mor pics here
http://s5.photobucket.com/albums/y169/my30mm/Macton/?sc=1&multi=1&addtype=local&media=image
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Postby michael » Sat May 13, 2006 4:32 pm

The contrast is something that really appeals to me, I am glad that I have finally sorted out the physical spaces. I feel confident now that there is a logical reason for the structures and the placement of them. The interesting thing about the brick is that only one small section of wall with two windows that I had actually bricked up had to be put aside(might find its way into another one of the unfinished layouts) :) The addition of the sandstone building really did give me a huge boost, I was not looking forward to many many more hours of squinting at watercolour paper bricks.
I am strugling with how to finish the loading dock without using more brick, I had thought of either corrugated iron or wood fancy siding similar to that used on a lot of GWR signal boxes. the covered roof over the loading dock will be a combination of asbestos corrugated sheets and a cast iron structure.

I had thought that the skylights would be a combination of the asbestos corrugated siding and the steep sides a wired glass I will cut out some holes in the roof so that I can get a little light through. so the north side would be facing the sandstone building.

I am now begining to get excited about all the little detail projects that will of course go on forever, or as long as I have the layout.

I started on the gate last night, I think that the letters for the factory name will have to be either etched or laser cut, both of which sound expensive :( but they do need to be crisp, and hand making them is a bit beyond my present skills.

for me this project is one that is helping me get something finished, it might take a while yet but as Andy pointed out in a post some time back actually getting something done provides a great sense of accomplishment.

Again thanks for all the positive feed back it really has helped me sort a few things out.
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Postby michael » Tue May 16, 2006 3:51 am

Today I had an idea that since these are wrought iron gates I would make the letters for the works name in the wrought iron fashion. so I took some 20 SWG copper wire .035" (.88mm) and flattened it in the vice. it took a few tries to get the hang of it so that it was consistent. I didnt worry about the texture on the vice jaws as it created a nice rough texture, then using some round nose & flat nosed pliers I bent up the first letters. I am pleased with the results. Sometimes the old fashioned ways of doing things actually ends up being easier. :)

Image

I have also started to work out the gate part as well, I took the twisted nickle silver square rod and flattened the end in the vice and then filed the shapes on the ends with some needle files.

I have to remake the horizontal bar because the drill wandered on a couple of the holes so the round rods are out of alignment :cry:

Image
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Postby michael » Thu Jun 01, 2006 6:11 am

Well I managed to get a few hours in today on the gate. I purchased some heavy gauge copper ground wire, 1 metre cost me $8:10 but it had 6 strands of copper about 5/64ths in diameter.

I flattened it on the anvil

Image

It took a while but rectangular flat copper strip is neigh on impossible to purchase anywhere :cry:

I got into the swing of of it so to speak and learned that depending on where you hit the copper it curled one way or tuther. so with a little practice i was able to make a fairly acceptable strip. I did use the vise to straighten out the strip. then drilled the holes for the vertical rods.

Image

It seemed that I was drilling holes for ever, they were .070" diam on .2" centers. you can see the original test strip of commercial brass by KS Engineering.

I prefer the hand wrought copper look.

Image
The one side of the gate is roughly assembled to get a sense of how to assemble it for soldering. The trickiest part was the curved top rail.
Finally I started to work on the oval sections for the overhead name section.

Image

Still a long way to go but I'll get there eventually.
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Postby michael » Thu Jun 01, 2006 2:45 pm

The Anvil is a scrap of rail from the Fort Edmonton Park standard guage 1900 era railway, I also managed to snag a few firebricks for my soldering station from the loco, since they replace them on a fairly frequent basis.
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Postby michael » Sat Jul 29, 2006 4:21 am

Having been inspired by both Sir Briand and Carl, with their wonderful trees I managed to scoop a few bits of sagebrush in the interior of British Columbia a few weeks back. I was thinking that since the Macton works had been there for a while and had gone through a few changes of ownership over the last 75 years or so, and because the original entry gates have been locked and unused for about 50 of those years, and the area inside the gates becoming a bit of a storage yard, it would be quite possible that a couple stray elms might have seeded naturally and because of their location were basically left alone to grow.

So after some very careful pruning this stuf is a bit fragile I think these trees will look a bit better with some early autumn foilage applied.

so for now it is winter at the Macton works.

Image

Image
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Postby michael » Sat Jul 29, 2006 1:47 pm

The elms across the alley from here (no the pic is not across the alley)look a bit like the trees I modelled, but they are of course American elms and not English elms.

The tall tree in the first picture is what I used as an inspiration for the tree close to the building, I took it in Charlotte North Carolina a few years ago.


Image


The second picture are the birches on my property at the lake, admitted they are paper birches. I cannot remember the birches in England or what they look like, other than the weeping birches in Hemel Hempstead.


Image

It occured to me this morning that perhaps the area along side the wall, would be overgrown with blackberry bushes and some vines into the railings as well. I do like the idea of root damage to the brick wall, it would give me an opportunity to try some of Marcel's amazing brickwork. Perhaps I could persuade someone to send me a packet of those little bricks to try it.

I will have a look at moving the big tree to the front away from the building, it was late last night when I first placed the trees. I will eventually get a backdrop and create the two viewpoints the one from the front and the one from the left side. so the important thing is to keep the trees if I decide to keep one or both within the confines of the display, traditional and conservative I gnow :roll:
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Postby michael » Sat Jul 29, 2006 4:39 pm

I couldn't put my finger on what was niggling the back of my mind, I wanted to add some tree material, I like the idea of the cut stump, it could have some suckers growing up from it, note the broken wall section caused by the tree before it was cut down.


Image




Image

And here is the overall way I am thinking of presenting the layout, the background is just a place holder for the eventual backdrop which will integrate with the foreground buildings. I'm still not sure how I want to do the trees or tree. :? the arch would be made of 1/8th ply and probably veneer rather than paint. the lighting would be diffuse with a gradation from front to back.
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Postby Sir Briand » Sat Jul 29, 2006 5:11 pm

How about trimming the tree :?:

Image

Then it ties in more with the ones in the background on the right. Even without these it is still not quite as overpowering.

Just call it a tree then no one will be so critical of its shape :twisted:
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Postby Sir Briand » Sat Jul 29, 2006 7:25 pm

Here's another thought

Image

Move the big tree forwards and eliminate the other. It should be right up against the front wall. There is room for vehicles etc to pass behind. It also acts as a "view divider" as you have to look to the left of it as well as the right. I used this idea extensively in Knotts Wharf. I think I would also turn the tree so that it leans to the right. This will help bring the eye back round into the picture rather than lead it up and away to the left and also act a a secondary frame.
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Postby Steve Bennett » Sat Jul 29, 2006 10:34 pm

I didn't realise that you intended to frame the layout Michael. With that being the case, losing the larger tree is definately the right move. I know you are still playing with it, but I think I would be inclined to narrow the height of the viewing window, compared to your mock-up, to something more like this:

Image

This would concentrate the gaze more on the modelled part, and the backdrop would not draw the eye away from it so much, acting just as a foil to the layout. Also the top of the tree would be hidden, allowing the viewer to speculate that it is a fair bit taller, but just an illusion :) I like the balance of it like this, just another opinion to throw into the melting pot :)
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Postby michael » Sat Jul 29, 2006 11:53 pm

"The plot thickens" pun intended. So from the sublime to the ridiculous, I have thought about all the comments and I am now leaning toward adding more trees, including one that is growing through the locked gate. The gate which will be derelict and rusty will be overgrown with a little ivy and a small tree growing up and through the gate.


Image


I have moved the big tree forward and crowded it with some smaller trees including some saplings growing on the embankment, these will be growing up through the brambles.


The cut trunk of a larger tree will have some saplings around it. By grouping a few mor trees into the open corner of the display case they provide a visual corner suport for that end of the model.



Image



The view from the loading dock works well for me.


The case reworked without the backdrop at the moment and showing the grouping with the tallest trees up into the top.

Image

I know that the perspective is wrong on the case but it gives the general idea.
Last edited by michael on Sun Jul 30, 2006 4:24 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby michael » Sun Jul 30, 2006 3:39 am

Thanks for the feedback guys, I like what you did to the case Steve, I will have a go at tidying it up now with the backdrop in. I do rather like the setting with the extra trees, it feels as if it is overgrown and not just a token tree. I like the lowering of the top, as it gets back to a more horizontal look and the layout feels longer.

I like the tall trees because they look more real to me, even so the tallest tree is only a scale 66 feet tall.

The tree in front of the tracks did change things a lot, it was just one of those madnesses that seemed to work, I had to prune off the lower branches that would have interferred with the loading gauge. I just wish I had more time at the moment. mucking about with those trees is the only thing I've done modelwise since finishing the swap project a month ago.
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Postby Blackcloud Railways » Sun Jul 30, 2006 6:56 am

The extra trees work well, with brambles and other weeds the foreground should be quite eyecatching.

Steve Bennett wrote:I really like that view from the loading dock aswell, maybe you should view the layout from the end


Joking or not Steve, it's a sound idea but perhaps a bit cramped from the loading dock due to the built up nature of that area. (Unless viewed through a window in the wall, as if from INSIDE the factory?)

How does the layout look from the gate end Michael? Are you planning to leave that end open allowing viewers to look into the yard through the rusty gate and its surrounding trees? It would be the logical viewpoint for "outsiders" to watch the works locos at work!

The end view can be a useful feature on a small layout, when the audience notice the extra aspect(s) they'll quite often watch for a bit longer to see the same operations again but from a different viewpoint. I quite enjoyed watching Brian Cameron's estate railway at Telford from the end as well as the front, and on Steve's own layout being not enclosed made for extra photo angles.


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